1988. 1988.05.10. Interjú Kádár Jánossal / HU_BFL_XIV_47_2

ours. Fór this reason, it is easier fór us now. As far as the urgency of change, that is subject of debate. How quickly things can be done, how, and what can be done. These are debatable questions. Bút now I will say something to you,

which probably is the same way in other places, bút is certainly so here, and must be taken intő consideration. Only those changes can be carried out in reality which are accepted by a significant portion of public opinion, and if possible, actively support, bút at least it must understand that these measures are necessary. Besides this, to a certain extent, the understanding of allies is alsó necessary in a certain sense. This is the determining factor fór the rate of

progress. If in Hungary we cannot convince people about the necessity of certain steps, then that cannot be carried out in reality. It is possible to decree it, it can be written down, bút in reality it cannot be carried out. Only if people understand it, adopt it, and accept that this is what is to be done and help in accomplishing it.

MCLAUGHLIN: One of the examples of perestroika and

glasnost is the rehabilitation of somé Russian-Soviet

political figures, and the re-evaluation of others.

Negatively, Joseph Stalin — positively, Mr. Bukharin. Let me ask you this question. Do you see any possibility of rehabilitation of Imre Nagy under a perestroika, under your reforms, as a kind of Hungárián version of what the Soviets are doing?

KADAR: In the Soviet Union, these issues which you have

mentioned are being dealt with. It must be added that reál and realistic historical evaluations are needed in the question of personalities who have played historical roles. That is, what is negative is negative, and what is nőt negative is nőt negative, and this applies to all individuals. -- You cannot solve all questions at one blow. Imre Nagy cannot be rehabilitated on certain issues. Evaluating what his subjective intentions were, that is a different question. You can always talk about that. Bút there are certain matters on which you cannot rehabilitate him. He gave up power which existed in Hungary, and he endeavored to dissolve the system of alliances without having legal authorization to do so, without convening the council of ministers or Parliament. He did this, even though these steps would have been necessary fór the dissolution of international agreements. On that point you cannot rehabilitate him. His subjective intentions are another question. It is a question of historical evaluation, a question of judgment. I have mentioned at important places that Imre Nagy has nőt been a

counterrevolutinary since the age of 14, and I did nőt consider him to be that on that on the basis of his intentions, bút certain facts exist independently of his subjective intentions, and [there was] what he did. That's

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